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Terry
Spectral Form
Joined: 16 Jun 2002
Posts: 798
Location: Dublin, Ireland
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 Posted: Sun Feb 18, 2007 10:25 pm Post subject: Need a little help here |
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I'm having a little trouble with the music for my contest entry. I've got the engine set up to use DUMB, and I've got a few riffs that sound ok on the guitar, but it takes me forever to get them to sound good on the computer.
Anyway, I was in Maplin's today and came across something cool:
1/4” Stereo Socket to 3.5mm Stereo Plug Adaptor
It was only a couple of quid, so I figured I'd chance it and see if I could use this to directly record some real guitar music for the game. I'm totally new to this, and I've got a few questions - hopefully someone here can help me out...
(1) First of all, when I connect up my guitar to the microphone socket on the computer with this thing, I don't get any sound at all. I can't work out why and I've tried everything, checking and unchecking all sorts of boxes. There just doesn't seem to be any microphone input. I'm sure I'll work it out eventually, but if anyone else has come across this before maybe they can point me in the right direction...
(2) Presuming I get this working, where to I go from there? I don't know where to start with audio recording software, as I've only ever used ModPlug. What software do people here use? Is there much of a learning curve? Do I need a special program to act as a pre-amp?
(3) If I actually make a song with this, I'm going to need to implement in into my game. Is there an Allegro library to play OGGs out there? (I'd rather not use FMOD because I want to make something commercial with my RPG engine down the line.)
(4) Anyone want to do the music for my game and save me all this hassle? :) It doesn't look like I'm going to have the time to do it properly myself.
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js71
Wandering DJ
Joined: 22 Nov 2002
Posts: 815
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| Posted: Mon Feb 19, 2007 2:11 am Post subject: |
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As far as I know, you can't plug a guitar straight into your computer and have it produce any sound-- I believe you need some sort of preamp for that to work.
Depending on the kind of music you want, I can probably do some tunes for you. At least a few songs, if I can't do the full thing for whatever reason.
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Nodtveidt
Demon Hunter
Joined: 11 Nov 2002
Posts: 786
Location: Camuy, PR
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| Posted: Mon Feb 19, 2007 2:28 am Post subject: |
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(1) What Josiah said.
(2) You could try Audacity, as it's free.
(3) Try OpenAL, it takes a bit of work to get up and running but it's worth the effort.
(4) Josiah ftw. :)
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BDZ
Slightly Deformed Faerie Princess
Joined: 11 Jan 2007
Posts: 32
Location: Wisconsin
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| Posted: Mon Feb 19, 2007 3:58 am Post subject: |
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| Josiah Tobin wrote: | As far as I know, you can't plug a guitar straight into your computer and have it produce any sound-- I believe you need some sort of preamp for that to work.
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Well, that's not true. From time to time I plug my Fender HSS Strat straight into my computer using a similar plug and ding around with it. I usually plug it in to the "line in." I use Win98 and you have to turn the line in volume up quite a bit, but it works fine. What works nice too is using your guitar with an amp, and micing the amp into the computer. (I did this last week with a junky headset microphone and it still sounded quite good.)
To record stuff, I use Audacity. Audacity can export OGG format, and it's got lots of other nice features.
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Bjorn
Demon Hunter
Joined: 29 May 2002
Posts: 1425
Location: Germany
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| Posted: Mon Feb 19, 2007 8:35 am Post subject: |
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(3) I've used alogg in the past, or a library with the same so-name called AllegroOGG, but that one seems to have fallen off the edge of the earth. I never tried OpenAL though, but I guess you should if you have the time. I still plan to look into using OpenAL some time.
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DeveloperX
202192397
Joined: 04 May 2003
Posts: 1626
Location: Decatur, IL, USA
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| Posted: Mon Feb 19, 2007 10:04 am Post subject: |
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I use Audactity & Cakewalk Guitar Tracks.
I use an adapter made for Apple by Monster Cable, it goes from Phono to Mini (guitar cable to std headphone jack) and plug my Gibson straight in. I mute microphone input, and use Line-In.
I turn the volume up to about half on the Line-In, and all the way on my guitar.
If you still need help, let me know.
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js71
Wandering DJ
Joined: 22 Nov 2002
Posts: 815
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| Posted: Mon Feb 19, 2007 9:12 pm Post subject: |
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| BDZ wrote: | | Josiah Tobin wrote: | As far as I know, you can't plug a guitar straight into your computer and have it produce any sound-- I believe you need some sort of preamp for that to work.
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Well, that's not true. From time to time I plug my Fender HSS Strat straight into my computer using a similar plug and ding around with it. I usually plug it in to the "line in." I use Win98 and you have to turn the line in volume up quite a bit, but it works fine. What works nice too is using your guitar with an amp, and micing the amp into the computer. (I did this last week with a junky headset microphone and it still sounded quite good.)
To record stuff, I use Audacity. Audacity can export OGG format, and it's got lots of other nice features. |
Ah, I didn't know that... Maybe I'll try to get that to work sometime.
Anyway, I usually just mic my "stack" (not really a stack, more on that in a sec) with a Sony F-V420 unidirectional mic-- The setup itself is very hacked together, I use a shitty old Fender Frontline 15 watt amp with a blown speaker, with an even shittier Yamaha 10 watter lined through the headphone jack of the Fender with a spare patch cable-- So basically the tinny little Yamaha is acting as a speaker for the Fedner's electronics. I don't know how, but it sounds great... I record everything with it. I think it may be because the Fender's really muddy and smoothed over on its own, but since the Yamaha is really tinny and crisp, and has hardly any low frequency output, it sort of balances it out. Or maybe it's just a complete fluke.
Here's a picture of the setup, anyway:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v294/Frog32/hackstack.jpg
(That Metal Zone distortion pedal isn't mine, by the way. I'd sure as hell be using it if it was)
I usually turn the volume down quite a bit and place the mic right up against the Yamaha's cloth-- I know, a no-no with a 'real' amp-- but If it's too loud it loses a lot of its quality, and if the mic's too far away when it's quiet, it loses almost all of its low-mid frequencies in the recording. My cheap mic probably has something to do with that as well. ;)
I record using Cool Edit Pro 2.0, with iZotope Ozone 3 for mastering and tweaking the individual tracks. I track my drums, ambiance, and sample layers with Modplug Tracker and whatever assorted samples I can find or hack together.
Here are some audio clips of my setup in action...
Clips from the soundtrack I did for a GoKart racing game a friend is developing:
Hellfuelled
Moth Wing Mountain
Pinwheel
Solefish
Assorted weirdness:
http://filexoom.com/files/2006/12/19/49300/Swimfail%20stuff/AUF_part1_clip2.mp3
http://filexoom.com/files/2006/12/19/49300/GTS_clip.mp3
Whew, long post, sorry about that. I tend to ramble on about these things.
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Terry
Spectral Form
Joined: 16 Jun 2002
Posts: 798
Location: Dublin, Ireland
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| Posted: Mon Feb 19, 2007 9:56 pm Post subject: |
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I was watching this thread expand all day at work, but didn't get a chance to reply. So here goes:
- Josiah, I've sent you a PM. I really appreciate your offer of help, and the music you've posted sounds excellent!
- I actually have a preamp knocking about somewhere in the form of a simple zoom effects pedal, but I think someone broke it on me a while ago. Plus I've no idea how it works. It seems to be stuck in configuration mode or something, heh.
- I haven't had a chance to try and fix this microphone thing yet. I'm starting to think there may be a problem with my laptop - probably because I dropped it last week.
- Thanks for the links to the sound libraries everyone - I'm going to look into all of them once the contest is finished, I think :) Right now I'm using DUMB, but as I'm not especially good at Tracking I'm not sure that's really a good long term approach for the engine.
- I've used Audacity, and I think it's a very nifty tool :) I haven't installed it on the laptop just yet though.
- DevX, what's the deal with "Cakewalk Guitar Tracks"? Is it a free tool? What does it do that Audacity doesn't? As for that adapter you mentioned, is it anything like the one I posted, or is it something more sophisticated?
Thanks for all the replies - hopefully I'll get another shot at getting this thing to work before the week's up, but to be honest, at this stage I think I'm just going to have to leave it until I finish the contest. There's just too much to learn and not enough time to learn it all.
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Nodtveidt
Demon Hunter
Joined: 11 Nov 2002
Posts: 786
Location: Camuy, PR
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| Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 12:55 am Post subject: |
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If it's Cakewalk, then the chances of it being free are about as slim as the chances of the US government stopping mandatory vaccinations.
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If you play a Microsoft CD backwards you can hear demonic voices. The scary part is that if you play it forwards it installs Windows. - wallace
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biggerUniverse
Mage
Joined: 18 Nov 2003
Posts: 326
Location: A small, b/g planet in the unfashionable arm of the galaxy
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| Posted: Wed Feb 21, 2007 4:19 am Post subject: |
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OpenAL is the frickin b0m
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DeveloperX
202192397
Joined: 04 May 2003
Posts: 1626
Location: Decatur, IL, USA
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| Posted: Thu Feb 22, 2007 2:54 pm Post subject: |
[quote] |
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| Echo wrote: |
- DevX, what's the deal with "Cakewalk Guitar Tracks"? Is it a free tool? What does it do that Audacity doesn't? As for that adapter you mentioned, is it anything like the one I posted, or is it something more sophisticated?
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The adapter is pretty much the same thing you posted.
http://www.academicsuperstore.com/market/marketdisp.html?PartNo=720711
Cakewalk Guitar Tracks is unfortunately not free. I payed about $99 at GuitarCenter for it. It has a ton of effects processors and and audio enhancing plugins, as well as supporting plugins from other audio packages such as cubase and sony's line of audio software, such as Acid.
In any event though, Audacity can be all that you need to record some great sounding stuff. And if you have the right equipment, to mix in other instruments such as midi keyboard & a nice mixer board, then you can mix it all, then patch it into the computer via line-in, and record into audacity.
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Terry
Spectral Form
Joined: 16 Jun 2002
Posts: 798
Location: Dublin, Ireland
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| Posted: Sat Feb 24, 2007 8:05 pm Post subject: |
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I've spent all evening trying to get ALOGG to work, and I think I'm just about ready to give up. I've had about a dozen different problems with this, every step of the way, and the latest one doesn't make any sense to me:
[Linker error] undefined reference to 'lib_mingw32_liballeg_a_iname'
[Linker error] undefined reference to `_nm__allegro_errno'
C:\My Stuff\alogg test\Makefile.win [Build Error] ["ogg] Error 1
I don't think I've broken my allegro installation btw - my current project still compiles fine. The only thing I can think of is that I had to make a static version of the library for ALOGG.
I'm trying to run a very simple test program - this one, to be exact:
| Code: |
/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
// Simple Allegro program
//
// AUTHOR :
// DATE :
// DESCRIPTION :
//
// Template created by Chad M. Draper (chad@dratek.com) on January 6, 2004
// using Dev-C++ version 4.9.8 (5.0 beta).
//
/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
// UPDATE LOG
// DATE DESCRIPTION
// ---- -----------
/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
// Include the Allegro header:
#include <Allegro>
/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
// Include the Alogg library:
#include <alogg>
/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
// Define the block size:
#define BLOCK_SIZE 4096
/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
// Main entry procedure
//
/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
int main()
{
// Streaming audio variables:
struct alogg_stream *pStream;
int iStreamUpdate = 1; // Initialize to >0
char pszAudioFile[ 256 ];
// Specify the name of the audio file:
// TODO: Replace <ogg_file_name> with the name of your ogg file
sprintf( pszAudioFile, "test.ogg" );
// Initialize Allegro:
allegro_init();
// Initialize the alogg library:
alogg_init();
// Install the keyboard:
install_keyboard();
// Create a 256x256 window:
if ( set_gfx_mode( GFX_AUTODETECT_FULLSCREEN | GFX_SAFE, 640, 480, 0, 0 ) )
{
// Error creating window:
allegro_message( "Error setting the graphics mode!" );
return 1;
}
// Write a message in the center of the screen:
allegro_message(pszAudioFile);
// Set the per-voice volume:
set_volume_per_voice( 0 );
// Initialize the sound module:
if ( install_sound( DIGI_AUTODETECT, MIDI_AUTODETECT, NULL ) < 0 )
{
fprintf( stderr, "Failed to initialize sound module\n" );
alogg_exit();
exit( 1 );
}
// Start streaming the audio:
if ( !( pStream = alogg_start_streaming( pszAudioFile, BLOCK_SIZE ) ) )
{
fprintf( stderr, "Failed to start streaming %s\n", pszAudioFile );
alogg_exit();
exit( 1 );
}
// Loop until the user presses the 'Escape' key:
while ( !key[ KEY_ESC ] )
{
// If iStreamUpdate is greater than 0, then there is still
// more audio data to stream. If it is 0, then we've come
// to the end of the file, and if its less than 0, there
// was an error.
if ( iStreamUpdate > 0 )
{
iStreamUpdate = alogg_update_streaming( pStream );
}
}
// Stop the audio streaming:
alogg_stop_streaming( pStream );
// Exit the alogg library:
alogg_exit();
// Return successful:
return 0;
}
END_OF_MAIN();
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And I'm linking these libraries:
-lalogg
-lalleg
-lvorbisfile
-lvorbisenc
-lvorbis
-logg
Any ideas, anyone?
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Ninkazu
Demon Hunter
Joined: 08 Aug 2002
Posts: 945
Location: Location:
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| Posted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 2:31 am Post subject: |
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Use AllegroOGG instead of alogg. It's a little older, but it works and is a lot easier to work with (it's a devpak).
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Terry
Spectral Form
Joined: 16 Jun 2002
Posts: 798
Location: Dublin, Ireland
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Terry
Spectral Form
Joined: 16 Jun 2002
Posts: 798
Location: Dublin, Ireland
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| Posted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 4:33 am Post subject: |
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And I'm glad I did. Twenty minutes of hacking and I've got it implemented in the engine. Sheesh. Thanks, Ninkazu.
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