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Black holes... and geniuses like LeoDraco
 
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LeoDraco
Demon Hunter


Joined: 24 Jun 2003
Posts: 584
Location: Riverside, South Cali

PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 2:41 am    Post subject: [quote]

LordGalbalan wrote:
Rigor = painstaking. (for me, and hell, every judge out there, and I don't think the Xs like LeoDraco find it that enjoyable either. Sorry, LeoDraco, just using you as a reference)


I very much so like and prefer rigor.
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Nephilim
Mage


Joined: 20 Jun 2002
Posts: 414

PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 6:01 am    Post subject: [quote]

LordGalbalan wrote:
No way. I want to know it all. I want the Knowledge Key.

If that's what you're after, then you should abandon the sciences altogether and go into religion. Religion has all the things you apparently want: it has the answer to everything, it puts individuals on high, it deals with absolutes instead of uncertainties, it responds to emotional appeals and pithy quotes, it doesn't ask you to cite scientific references, and all of that without having to sully yourself with math and rigor.

LordGalbalan wrote:
Rigor = painstaking. (for me, and hell, every judge out there

That's the second time you've referred to "judges." Who are these fictional judges, and why do you always assume they would agree with you?

Many people enjoy working rigorously. And you should be thankful for it every time you drink a glass of water, because there are several people working rigorously between you and a glass with 1% sewage in it. 99% is not good enough. Being rigorous is about making no mistakes.

In the case of mathematics, rigor is enjoyable for at least two reasons. The first reason is the challenge. When you finally succeed in proving that theorem, especially if you come up with a beautiful, artistic, and elegant way of doing it, you get a sense of satisfaction that you simply don't get just by reading the theorem. If you've ever completed a tough crossword puzzle, you should understand the sense of satisfaction that you can get.

The second reason is the rush of epiphany. There are moments when you're struggling into new territory, and your brain just can't wrap around the concept, when - bang! - everything clicks, and you break upon whole new vistas of understanding that you never knew before. All the things that seemed so inscrutable before suddenly seem very natural and straightforward. It's a great feeling.

These are the rewards of a mathematician, and they are part and parcel with the rigor. For someone who is so interested in collecting knowledge, I would think that challenge and epiphany would be the sorts of rewards you'd understand, even if you don't share an interest in the particular subject matter.

LordGalbalan wrote:
Half coded in knowledge, and half in that damnable mathematical rigor.

What you mean is that you understand half of it, and you don't understand the other half. It's all "knowledge."

LordGalbalan wrote:
Just enough coded in rigor to leave one wondering how to get more out of all this information than the knowledge it provides directly.

Few things are more direct than an equation. Just because you don't understand it, that doesn't make it indirectly presented.
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tcaudilllg
Dragonmaster


Joined: 20 Jun 2002
Posts: 1731
Location: Cedar Bluff, VA

PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 9:16 pm    Post subject: [quote]

Well... "Judging" is the process of reaching conclusions. Perceiving is the process of beginning new things. When you have the two, you have a usable product.

My process of conceptualization is the reverse of yours. I tend to see the "big picture" first, and only all at once does the link between the "big picture" and a concrete advance in understanding occur, when I see how different parts of the big picture interconnect with each other, and exchange information. That makes me a "judge", because I get the result after my unconscious self does the rigor for me. If you want to know more about how I think, hit that link in my sig.

Come to think of it, let's compare "knowledge" and "wisdom". Judges want knowledge; perceivers want "wisdom". But what is knowledge to you, is wisdom to me. Like fire and water, earth and sky, negative and positive, energy and matter. Yes, energy and matter are perfect characterizations. You are energy, I am matter.

LeoDraco wrote:

I so much like and prefer rigor.


Do you prefer rigor over conjecture? Perhaps you don't understand what I mean by "rigor". That is to suggest, you prefer walking out the steps of a mathematical equation for the sole purpose of conquering your own profound insecurity over the conjectural, hypothetical viewpoint of "knowing" the applied "form" of the equation in the surrounding world? Or do you prefer both equally?

E or M? Or E=mc^2?
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LeoDraco
Demon Hunter


Joined: 24 Jun 2003
Posts: 584
Location: Riverside, South Cali

PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 9:39 pm    Post subject: [quote]

LordGalbalan wrote:
Do you prefer rigor over conjecture?


Yes. I said as much, did I not?

Quote:
Perhaps you don't understand what I mean by "rigor".


Given your propensity to imbue words with fanciful and nefarious definitions which are---at times---completely at odds with traditional usage---rendering most of what you say damned near impossible to comprehend---that quite likely might be the case. However, I don't think you know what "rigor" means. While some on this forum snear at the very use of wikipedia as a source of reference, perhaps a definition therefrom would suit?

Quote:
That is to suggest, you prefer walking out the steps of a mathematical equation for the sole purpose of conquering your own profound insecurity over the conjectural, hypothetical viewpoint of "knowing" the applied "form" of the equation in the surrounding world?


You might find this amazing, but the canonical viewpoint of the scientist is one of skepticism. Of course I prefer to actually show that the "conjectural" is, in point of fact, correct! The more rigorous---and, hopefully, the more "correct" due to that rigor---the better. Fanciful theories without a firm, rigorous basis are, literally, useless. Especially if they cannot be proven.
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Last edited by LeoDraco on Thu Jun 30, 2005 2:17 am; edited 1 time in total
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tcaudilllg
Dragonmaster


Joined: 20 Jun 2002
Posts: 1731
Location: Cedar Bluff, VA

PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 10:27 pm    Post subject: [quote]

If the model conforms with experiment, is is correct in that case. The challenge is matching the model with the conditions.

From rigor you get the model. From experience you get the conditions.

Which definition of rigor? There are several listed on Wikipedia. Should I presume you meant the first two? (intellectual rigor, intellectual honesty)

Nevermind, I need to find a new place to live. My lease ends tonight. :P
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janus
Mage


Joined: 29 Jun 2002
Posts: 464
Location: Issaquah, WA

PostPosted: Thu Jun 30, 2005 10:10 am    Post subject: [quote]

LordGalbalan wrote:
My lease ends tonight. :P
Your lease on life, I hope?
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tcaudilllg
Dragonmaster


Joined: 20 Jun 2002
Posts: 1731
Location: Cedar Bluff, VA

PostPosted: Thu Jun 30, 2005 9:26 pm    Post subject: [quote]

janus wrote:
LordGalbalan wrote:
My lease ends tonight. :P
Your lease on life, I hope?


Nah, yours hopefully.
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janus
Mage


Joined: 29 Jun 2002
Posts: 464
Location: Issaquah, WA

PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2005 12:34 am    Post subject: [quote]

LordGalbalan wrote:
janus wrote:
LordGalbalan wrote:
My lease ends tonight. :P
Your lease on life, I hope?


Nah, yours hopefully.
That doesn't make any sense. You said it was your lease!
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tcaudilllg
Dragonmaster


Joined: 20 Jun 2002
Posts: 1731
Location: Cedar Bluff, VA

PostPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2005 10:44 pm    Post subject: [quote]

No big deal or anything, but I intuited today that the theory of probability is dual with the General Relativity theory. More later, maybe.
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Mandrake
elementry school minded asshole


Joined: 28 May 2002
Posts: 1341
Location: GNARR!

PostPosted: Thu Jul 07, 2005 11:58 am    Post subject: [quote]

I intuited today that your mother is a whore.
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biggerUniverse
Mage


Joined: 18 Nov 2003
Posts: 326
Location: A small, b/g planet in the unfashionable arm of the galaxy

PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2005 7:39 am    Post subject: [quote]

LordGalby has the ability to do at least one thing: start and maintain very long threads.
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Happy
JonA's American snack pack


Joined: 03 Aug 2002
Posts: 200

PostPosted: Mon Jul 11, 2005 8:59 am    Post subject: RELATIVELY DRUNK [quote]

I just intuited that I have just drunk too much alcohol for someone of my body weight.

I was eating ice cream. It was chocolate chip and mint. And I was sipping some Vodka. This is a delicious combination for consumption. I do recommend.

I was giddy with inebriation, and decided to strike up a conversation.

"I'm drinking Vodka and eating mint chocolate chip ice cream." I said to some random person on my buddy list. "That's code for 'Hello, asscunt.'"

"Okay." The person replied. "God, that sounds good actually."

"I'm glad we have that all cleared up. Wait -- the ice cream and vodka or the asscunt?"

"Both really."

"Heh, okay. I don't know who the fuck you are. What the fuck?"

"You're Happy, right?"

"Right." I said, and then wondered how he could've known. I looked at his screen name and there was 'guilt' in it.

"WAIT. SKYWISE?" I exclaimed, "ISAAC COHEN? AM I, AM I, AM I RIGHT?"

"Yesh."

"HAHAHA IT WAS THE GUILT, THE GUILT TOLDED ME." I was happy with this new development. "When did I add you to my buddy list? How long has it been? There are a lot of people on here that I never talk to, I loose track. I forget. These things happen. I apologize."

"It's okay."

"You don't talk much. You're depressingly unresponsive. Why? You're not masturbating or anything are? Are you? Silly vodka. It's messing up my typing."

"I'm reading about rashes."

"Oh. Is it interesting? These rashes."

"Not really."

"That's too bad. I watched A Clockwork Orange a day or so ago. What are your thoughts on that matter?"

"Read the book."

"That's it? That's all you have to say?"

"Yes."

That fucking bastard, I thought, I need more vodka.
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XMark
Guitar playin' black mage


Joined: 30 May 2002
Posts: 870
Location: New Westminster, BC, Canada

PostPosted: Mon Jul 11, 2005 10:50 am    Post subject: [quote]

I just had a breakthrough!

If you were to further study the intrinsic spacial attributes of a trilinear splurge buffer, you would realize that it is in fact dimensionally reticulated. In other words, the isometric delimiting factors of the recursive astral plateau would in fact cancel out the latent coagulation which you would normally expect in that situation.

Of course, this isn't taking into account the random perturbations in the tertiary plasmic flow, but as can be demonstrated by the formula X=E^(fl)/2 + gh it doesn't make a significant difference in the periodic biomass dispersal wave. (assuming h remains constant)

The solution to this conundrum is simple: since the number of anti-protons which can simultaneously fellate a quark far outweighs the plasmic destabilizing factor, it is quite safe to introduce concurrent phase distortions. In fact, the reaction will create enough energy to allow for a fractal cryonic impulse!
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Abstract Productions
I PLAYS THE MUSIC THAT MAKES THE PEOPLES FALL DOWN!
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Mandrake
elementry school minded asshole


Joined: 28 May 2002
Posts: 1341
Location: GNARR!

PostPosted: Mon Jul 11, 2005 11:52 am    Post subject: [quote]

Skywise? No shit. That takes me back.

Quote:


I was eating ice cream. It was chocolate chip and mint. And I was sipping some Vodka. This is a delicious combination for consumption. I do recommend.


Odd- last night I was eating mint chocalate chip with Rum poured ontop of it. Also a good combination. Strange these little coincidences.
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"Well, last time I flicked on a lighter, I'm pretty sure I didn't create a black hole."-
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tcaudilllg
Dragonmaster


Joined: 20 Jun 2002
Posts: 1731
Location: Cedar Bluff, VA

PostPosted: Mon Jul 11, 2005 8:56 pm    Post subject: [quote]

XMark wrote:
I just had a breakthrough!

If you were to further study the intrinsic spacial attributes of a trilinear splurge buffer, you would realize that it is in fact dimensionally reticulated. In other words, the isometric delimiting factors of the recursive astral plateau would in fact cancel out the latent coagulation which you would normally expect in that situation.

Of course, this isn't taking into account the random perturbations in the tertiary plasmic flow, but as can be demonstrated by the formula X=E^(fl)/2 + gh it doesn't make a significant difference in the periodic biomass dispersal wave. (assuming h remains constant)

The solution to this conundrum is simple: since the number of anti-protons which can simultaneously fellate a quark far outweighs the plasmic destabilizing factor, it is quite safe to introduce concurrent phase distortions. In fact, the reaction will create enough energy to allow for a fractal cryonic impulse!


You know I'm trying to make sense out of that, right? :\
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