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| After reading the linked file, would you consider buying the book? |
| Yes |
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20% |
[ 3 ] |
| No |
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80% |
[ 12 ] |
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| Total Votes : 15 |
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Bjorn
Demon Hunter
Joined: 29 May 2002
Posts: 1425
Location: Germany
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 Posted: Thu Nov 18, 2004 2:18 pm Post subject: |
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The only particular thing I noticed about the book's contents is the usage of questions as titles. I think it looks silly, it's something you might want to try to avoid.
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DeveloperX
202192397
Joined: 04 May 2003
Posts: 1626
Location: Decatur, IL, USA
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| Posted: Thu Nov 18, 2004 7:00 pm Post subject: |
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| Bjørn wrote: | | The only particular thing I noticed about the book's contents is the usage of questions as titles. I think it looks silly, it's something you might want to try to avoid. |
I don't intend to use the exact text from the outline in the book.
I agree, using questions as titles is a little silly, I simply wanted to specify what would be covered, and where it would be covered within the book.
--
As to those of you who think that my book is lacking enough content:
1. That is why there are 3 or 4 books, not just 1.
2. Random maps are not covered in the first book, because it isn't a topic that needs to be covered for a console-style role playing game. I haven't seen any random maps in final fantasy. :)
3. I don't introduce scrolling until later, as I wanted to make sure that the reader understands in full, how maps work, how to create an editor for the non scrolling maps, etc, before I throw scrolling into the mix, and complicate things.
No, I don't find scrolling complicated, but alot of newbies do. I don't want my books to frustrate the reader. I want my books to guide the reader to his or her goal. :)
Anyway, I've put alot of thought into the map editor that will be built in Chapter 10, and I've gotten some great feedback on the design so far.
First off, it is easily extendable.
It supports customizable GUIs.
Multiple tile sizes, and near unlimited tiles.
Easy to use, and portable to other operating systems.
And it comes in multiple 'flavors' as the reader progresses in the book. :)
Well, gotta run for now. ~ cya.
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LeoDraco
Demon Hunter
Joined: 24 Jun 2003
Posts: 584
Location: Riverside, South Cali
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| Posted: Thu Nov 18, 2004 8:13 pm Post subject: |
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| DeveloperX wrote: | | 2. Random maps are not covered in the first book, because it isn't a topic that needs to be covered for a console-style role playing game. I haven't seen any random maps in final fantasy. :) |
Ah. But there are console style RPGs that had random map generation. On the PSX, there was Azure Dreams (there was, like, a 100 floor dungeon, each floor of which was randomly generated every time the dungeon was entered); more recently, there were the Dark Cloud games, in which the dungeons (at least in the first) were also randomly generated. Even more recently, there was the .hack series, which purported to simulate a computer MMO (as this post suggest, dungeon maps were randomly generated).
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Bjorn
Demon Hunter
Joined: 29 May 2002
Posts: 1425
Location: Germany
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| Posted: Thu Nov 18, 2004 9:14 pm Post subject: |
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I think random map generation is interesting enough to write a whole chapter about, and that DeveloperX is right about not having to include it in his first book, even though many games use random maps (it's also what gives Diablo and Diablo 2 their high replay value, and the Roguelike genre). Before writing such a chapter, he'll probably want to try out different methods too.
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DeveloperX
202192397
Joined: 04 May 2003
Posts: 1626
Location: Decatur, IL, USA
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| Posted: Thu Nov 18, 2004 9:18 pm Post subject: |
[quote] |
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| LeoDraco wrote: | | Ah. But there are console style RPGs that had random map generation. On the PSX, there was Azure Dreams (there was, like, a 100 floor dungeon, each floor of which was randomly generated every time the dungeon was entered); more recently, there were the Dark Cloud games, in which the dungeons (at least in the first) were also randomly generated. Even more recently, there was the .hack series, which purported to simulate a computer MMO (as this post suggest, dungeon maps were randomly generated). |
Interesting. Dark Cloud is a 3D adventure/rpg mostly adventure, there are very few rpg elements. I own it, played it, got bored with it. I wasn't impressed with it. I recently played Final Fantasy 2, and was quite impressed. To me, console style rpgs are the old-school Final Fantasy games. Yes there are others, though I haven't played many of them, and none stick out like the FF series. Granted FFVII was 2D/3D ~ and the last good FF ~ I don't consider 3D games to be console-rpgs.
I'm not covering 3D. I will not cover 3D. I do not like 3D rpgs.
Random maps are more for diablo-clone style hack-slash/rpgs,
than for story-driven ff-clone rpgs.
I will cover random map generation techniques, but I'm not covering random map generation techniques in the first book. I think that is too complex of a concept for a newbie to grasp. If someone wants to have random maps in their game, let them pick up another book, dedicated to advanced topics.
~gotta run.
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LeoDraco
Demon Hunter
Joined: 24 Jun 2003
Posts: 584
Location: Riverside, South Cali
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| Posted: Fri Nov 19, 2004 12:00 am Post subject: |
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| DeveloperX wrote: | To me, console style rpgs are the old-school Final Fantasy games. Yes there are others, though I haven't played many of them, and none stick out like the FF series. Granted FFVII was 2D/3D ~ and the last good FF ~ I don't consider 3D games to be console-rpgs.
I'm not covering 3D. I will not cover 3D. I do not like 3D rpgs. |
You might not care for them, but a lot of people do; especially the current generation of gamers. I personally have no problems with 3D rpgs, and think that anyone who has your opinion is rather elitist.
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Rainer Deyke
Demon Hunter
Joined: 05 Jun 2002
Posts: 672
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| Posted: Fri Nov 19, 2004 12:29 am Post subject: |
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| LeoDraco wrote: | | You might not care for them, but a lot of people do; especially the current generation of gamers. I personally have no problems with 3D rpgs, and think that anyone who has your opinion is rather elitist. |
You think everybody who has a different opinion from you is elitist.
Personally I'm not a big fan of 3D rpgs either. They tend to look ugly, they tend to be hard to navigate, and they tend to sacrifice gameplay and story in favor of technology. I've played 3D rpgs that I've enjoyed, but given a choice, I'll usually go with the 2D rpg.
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LeoDraco
Demon Hunter
Joined: 24 Jun 2003
Posts: 584
Location: Riverside, South Cali
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| Posted: Fri Nov 19, 2004 12:44 am Post subject: |
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| Rainer Deyke wrote: | | LeoDraco wrote: | | You might not care for them, but a lot of people do; especially the current generation of gamers. I personally have no problems with 3D rpgs, and think that anyone who has your opinion is rather elitist. |
You think everybody who has a different opinion from you is elitist. |
You're such an elitist. [/sarcasm]
I have no problem with his opinion; I just think that his opinion is limiting him. If ever I come off as you say (that you think that I think everyone who differs in opinion from me is elitist), that isn't the case. Generally, I have no problem with others having divergent opinions from my own. I do, however, have a problem when people think that they are better than me (or those that have similar tastes to me) because of their opinion.
But yeah: if it makes you feel better, Rainer Deyke, honey, that's the way I see everyone else.
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Mandrake
elementry school minded asshole
Joined: 28 May 2002
Posts: 1341
Location: GNARR!
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| Posted: Fri Nov 19, 2004 1:11 pm Post subject: |
[quote] |
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Ah. But there are console style RPGs that had random map generation. On the PSX, there was Azure Dreams (there was, like, a 100 floor dungeon, each floor of which was randomly generated every time the dungeon was entered); more recently, there were the Dark Cloud games, in which the dungeons (at least in the first) were also randomly generated. Even more recently, there was the .hack series, which purported to simulate a computer MMO (as this post suggest, dungeon maps were randomly generated).
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Don't forget the Evolution games on the Dreamcast, which were about as old skool console style RPG as you could get without reverting into 2d 16 colour graphics. Now, I would have to disagree (probably to the surprise of everyone here) about not liking 2d in favor of 3d games. I love RPG's of all forms. A lot of *improvements* in the genre, I think, have been setbacks at some point (ie- larger focus on story and cinematics, larger customizations- but I'll get into that later), but that has nothing to do with graphics. Some games I still find lots of fun to play no matter what style of graphics they use.
I'd have to agree- not liking a game because of it's graphics is elitist. What if someone said they perferred 3d games to 2d games? And wouldn't play 2d games at all because of it?
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Hajo
Demon Hunter
Joined: 30 Sep 2003
Posts: 779
Location: Between chair and keyboard.
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| Posted: Fri Nov 19, 2004 1:51 pm Post subject: |
[quote] |
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| Mandrake wrote: |
I'd have to agree- not liking a game because of it's graphics is elitist. What if someone said they perferred 3d games to 2d games? And wouldn't play 2d games at all because of it? |
It's all a matter of taste. Unless they become missionary and try to convert everyone to their preferences, I don't care. I know what I like, and that's enough :)
Is ignorance elitism?
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