| View previous topic - View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Rainer Deyke
Demon Hunter
Joined: 05 Jun 2002
Posts: 672
|
 Posted: Mon Jun 23, 2003 7:12 pm Post subject: |
[quote] |
|
| Mandrake wrote: |
and PC RPG's are different how?
|
Many PC RPGs (such as the gold box AD&D games, the Magic Candle series, or even Ultima 6) include at least some of the tactical options I described. Heck, even Baldur's Gate (which IMO had one of the worst RPG combat systems ever) had some of those tactical options.
| Quote: |
god you guys fucking bitch way too much. If you don't like RPG combat, don't make/play RPG's. Yeesh. If you play 'em cause you like plots in your works, add plot. HalfLife did it. It's an FPS for certain, but it had a cool plot. |
I disliked HalfLife. I liked ChronoTrigger overall, even though the combat system was a bit shallow.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Locrian
Wandering Minstrel
Joined: 04 Apr 2003
Posts: 105
Location: VA USA
|
| Posted: Mon Jun 23, 2003 7:13 pm Post subject: |
[quote] |
|
|
I'm still like level 12 in Morrowind. I need to get back to that game heh. Spend all my game time playing Medal of Honor. Oh right... I don't play Morrowind cause my CD drive is dead. Forgot. Dammit.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
js71
Wandering DJ
Joined: 22 Nov 2002
Posts: 815
|
| Posted: Mon Jun 23, 2003 7:19 pm Post subject: |
[quote] |
|
|
Actually, you can fall through the floor in morrowind too... But maybe it's cause my version's hacked.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
DrV
Wandering Minstrel
Joined: 15 Apr 2003
Posts: 148
Location: Midwest US
|
| Posted: Mon Jun 23, 2003 9:06 pm Post subject: |
[quote] |
|
| Locrian wrote: | | I'm still like level 12 in Morrowind. I need to get back to that game heh. Spend all my game time playing Medal of Honor. Oh right... I don't play Morrowind cause my CD drive is dead. Forgot. Dammit. |
How do you play MoH if your CD drive is dead?.... I thought it needs a cd too...
_________________
Don't ask no stupid questions and I won't send you away.
If you want to talk fishing, well, I guess that'll be okay.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Locrian
Wandering Minstrel
Joined: 04 Apr 2003
Posts: 105
Location: VA USA
|
| Posted: Mon Jun 23, 2003 9:56 pm Post subject: |
[quote] |
|
|
CD crackamajig
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Mandrake
elementry school minded asshole
Joined: 28 May 2002
Posts: 1341
Location: GNARR!
|
| Posted: Mon Jun 23, 2003 10:25 pm Post subject: |
[quote] |
|
| Quote: |
Hmmm not to butt heads with you or anything... but since when did battle system style become part of the definition of RPG?
|
Of a classic RPG, yes. And since when did it become a definition of it? Since Dungeans and Dragons became an offshoot of a tactical startegy game called "ChainMail". Since RPG's take their root in table-top RPG's, they are trying to emulate that game play with a computer, rather than with a table fo friends. and so far, no real time combat has been created/will work with a table-top RPG in real life.
Unless you count playing LARPS- but people who play LARP's scare me.
| Quote: |
There are certainly some often used styles, but saying you have to go with these for it to be an RPG is like saying your main character has to be a young man whos family has been murdered and must go fight the evil wizard and rescue the damsel in distress. If someone wants to use these typical-to-RPG elements thats fine, but if they want to conciously avoid them thats cool too, and doesn't automatically take away from the game's RPGness.
|
never said it did. What I meant was, it becomes a cross-bred game, IE borrowing elements from non-rpg games. Nothing wrong with this. Hell, FF7/8/9 basically took adventure gaming elements and made an RPG/adventure game hybrid. But, what I was saying was WRONG is people who:
| Quote: |
complain when other people make games with turn based combat- like peopole dropping scores in a games review because it was turn based instead of action based. That's just wrong to me.
And saying "console games" or X games suck because they use turn based- I don't know. It's like comparing apples to oranges. If you don't like it, that's fine, but it doesn't mean games with a diferent element (and thus aappeal to diferent people) are not as valid as the games you enjoy.
|
| Quote: |
Just kinda sounds like youre saying these are necissary for it to be an RPG. You could have an RPG with no battle system at all. I have no idea what that guy meant by making it more like a fighter or FPS though... he needs to explain his thoughts a little more.
|
agreed. he does need to explain. I'm sorry I wasn't clear, what I meant was, that people complaining about turn-based games, portraying them egatively, as if they have no redeeming value, that angers me because to me, those games do have redeeming value. It frustrates me that people want to make RPG's, but don't like a certain aspect about them (and yes, Turn based RPG's have been around, and used the longest. Again, since they are based on emulating table-top games, you could almost say it's inherit in the system. Not to say action-rpg's are not rpg's, but they need to have the prefix of action....I know that doesn't make much sense, but it's hard for me to explain this clearly)
| Quote: |
Did you use a 3D program to make the spell effect? It kinda looks like it for some reason. Man I gotta track down that guy that was making awesome spell effects with the aid of 3DSMax. They looked really professional.
|
Nope. just plain old pixel-art. When it comes to 3d, I'm lost like a little kitten.
| Quote: |
Ah, Jihgfed, turnbased is more relaxed, ok... I can kind of see how someone could prefer it to real time now. Though it tends to do the opposite to me. Hit for 50 points of damage? bullshit! I can dodge your stupid attacks! Lemme move dammit!
|
But in the sense of tabletop-rpg's, you shouldn't be able to peronally dodge that attack, since in the world of RPG's, you are playing absed on your charachter's skill, not your skill. I mean, if you supposed to have, let's say, a weakling wizard who can't dodge, then he shouldn't be able to. But he should be able to do really nifty spell effects.
| Quote: |
Also interesting how you feel turnbased allows you to be swept in more. I feel the opposite. All of a sudden being unable to move freely, or even worse being teleported to another screen... Crazy how differently two people can be effected by things.
|
Well it depends. I can agree to some extent that Turn based battles can be annoying, esp in some games where every two inches you walk, another enemy pop ups. That can be very frustrating, adn it does take away from the game immersion from me. But just turn based battles themselves, they don't. In fact, tehy can draw me in more. Of course, that's coming from a background of playing RPG's, both table and video game, for longer than most.
| Quote: |
I'm the same way. I mean, I love strategic battle systems, I just get sick of stuff fast if its long and drawn-out and you have to do it all the time.
|
then why do you play/make RPGs? If you don't enjoy it, why do it?
| Quote: |
This is something I love. Games like Deus Ex, System Shock 2, Morrowind
|
Hmmm, the only game above those that I remember as being listed as an "RPG" was Morrowind. The rest, if I remember correctly, were classified as by the creators of said games, as FPS.
| Quote: |
I get what you're saying here. I enjoy at least having some element of strategy in a battle system, and that's the only reason I haven't already jumped on the action bandwagon. I mean, I do like action RPGs, I just find the fighting a little simplistic and repetitive. Then again, I suppose the same thing could be said for a lot of turn-based games, so I guess it may just be an issue of whether you prefer to select your attacks from a menu or just press a button. Heh.
|
well, the same could be said for FPS, Schmups, etc. Yeah, most games the combat can get repetitive...but that's what makes them fun.
| Quote: |
Heh, imagine that, I agree here too. I hate that lack of freedom games give you. I'm not really sure which point of view I agree with more.
|
that's a large problem with game playing/creating, balancing player freedom with fun. If you give the player too many choices at oncve, the gameplay can become unweildy adn hard to figure out. OTOH, if you take away most freedoms of the player, the game will be too simplistic and no fun at all. But then again, Dragon's Lair was a huge hit...
_________________
"Well, last time I flicked on a lighter, I'm pretty sure I didn't create a black hole."-
Xmark
http://pauljessup.com
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Quickbeam
Pretty, Pretty Fairy Princess
Joined: 19 Nov 2002
Posts: 8
Location: Ontario, Canada
|
| Posted: Mon Jun 23, 2003 11:09 pm Post subject: |
[quote] |
|
| Quote: | | then why do you play/make RPGs? If you don't enjoy it, why do it? |
Alright, what I'd said there was a little poorly phrased. I simply dislike games that get too repetitive. I mean, obviously, all games have repetitive elements, but I find there's a certain line between doing something over and over while still enjoying it, and eventually coming to hate it because you've done it so much. Not all games cross this line, but some do, especially if they're longer games. For example, I loved the battle system of Xenogears, but by the end of the game I tried to avoid battles at all costs because I was so sick of it. The only reason I continued to play was for the story.
| Quote: | | Hmmm, the only game above those that I remember as being listed as an "RPG" was Morrowind. The rest, if I remember correctly, were classified as by the creators of said games, as FPS. |
Maybe so, but SS2 and Deus Ex both have very RPG-like elements, and there's absolutely no disputing that. It's true that they're more FPS than RPG, but still. Also, just for kicks, I've got the Deus Ex (GotY Edition) box right beside me, and it actually says at the top "Intense Action Role-Playing", heh. The genres are really blurring these days, and we all know its difficult to define what is and isnt an RPG. A matter of opinion, I suppose.
| Quote: | | well, the same could be said for FPS, Schmups, etc. Yeah, most games the combat can get repetitive...but that's what makes them fun. |
I'd have to disagree on that point. Being repetitive is in no way what makes them fun, IMO. I mean, you like a game, so you play it again. But you don't like it -because- you're playing it again, if that makes any sense. What I mean is, you don't like things because they're repetitive, you like them because you liked them the first time, so you enjoy doing it again.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Suchiiben
Guest
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 24, 2003 3:37 am Post subject: |
[quote] |
|
Just like people have been saying: System Shock 1-2, Deus Ex, Elder Scrolls
I want RPGs with quick, fast-paced fights. If I'm going to be fighting stuff over and over again, it had better be seamless and fun.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Sirocco
Mage
Joined: 01 Jun 2002
Posts: 345
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 24, 2003 5:26 am Post subject: |
[quote] |
|
| Quote: |
I hate that lack of freedom games give you.
|
Be careful what you wish for! Games work because they force the player to work within certain anticipated constraints. More freedom means more potential exploits (thereby ruining the game experience), and exponentially increasing the work load for the developers and QA flunkies.
.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
golrien
Milk Maid
Joined: 09 Jun 2002
Posts: 40
Location: Shropshire, England
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 24, 2003 8:48 pm Post subject: |
[quote] |
|
Very true, heh... the aim of this game is actually going to be on giving the player a bunch of freedom (as far as I know, it's not my department :), but it'll obviously boil down to "do any quests you want towards an ultimate target" or something. Really, I think the only change we'll have to put in is where the instinct is to block off another solution to a puzzle, we'll allow it (as long as it doesn't make the game piss easy, heh).. for example (can't remember if this was referring to island game or another one, but it's a great idea nonetheless), if there's a huge area of grassland that you need to cross, you can (a) walk over it, battling the occasional monster and generally feeling bored or (b) hijack a bus and drive there really quickly.
I guess that sounds more like GTA than an RPG, but you get the idea, heh... it's going to be pretty interesting to make, considering how much I usually hate the kind of "non-linear" ideas.. you can say it gives you extra replay value, but often you'll end up doing most of the same quests again. Maybe it's just that I'm too compulsive and have to find *all* the quests, I guess our solution to this problem might be "make all the quests suck so nobody wants to play more" :)
Anyway, that's some fine offtopic rambling on a subject that isn't really mine for reasons I no longer remember :)
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Ironshanks
Wandering Minstrel
Joined: 17 Feb 2003
Posts: 134
Location: Shiner's Peak
|
| Posted: Sun Jul 06, 2003 5:24 pm Post subject: |
[quote] |
|
Would anyone else consider River City Ransom an RPG? Obviously very action-oriented, but I mean if you consider Zelda an RPG...
_________________
That's not a broken link, it's a PICTURE of a broken link. It's really very conceptual.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
  |
Page 2 of 2 |
All times are GMT
Goto page Previous 1, 2
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
|
