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resle
Slightly Deformed Faerie Princess


Joined: 23 Jun 2003
Posts: 32
Location: Roma, Italy

PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2003 2:17 pm    Post subject: Progresses, progresses, progresses... [quote]

pathfinding implemented (not that easy in 3d), more world dynamics added... some (still rough) shadows... progresses! :)

and now, the inevitable couple of screenshots assembled with the few material (in terms of 3d models and 2d art) I've got...






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Ninkazu
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Joined: 08 Aug 2002
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2003 4:46 pm    Post subject: [quote]

Black... outline.... horrible.....
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resle
Slightly Deformed Faerie Princess


Joined: 23 Jun 2003
Posts: 32
Location: Roma, Italy

PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2003 5:25 pm    Post subject: [quote]

Gives that cartoonish feeling! Without the black outline, those hyper-real brilliant colors are...uhm... I can't explain. That's better, trust me :)
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valderman
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Joined: 29 Aug 2002
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Location: Gothenburg, Sweden

PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2003 6:11 pm    Post subject: [quote]

For cartoonish look, go with cel-shading, it will probably look better. Those black lines are kind of annoying.
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resle
Slightly Deformed Faerie Princess


Joined: 23 Jun 2003
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Location: Roma, Italy

PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2003 6:23 pm    Post subject: [quote]

99% of the Cel Shading algorithms are inclusive of that outline, there are also many different techniques to trace it... anyhow yes: I should try. Cel shading and NO outline. Let's how it looks!
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2003 10:00 pm    Post subject: [quote]

So how did you do pathfinding? A*? How do you have the map organized? A 2d array of open/clear places?
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BigManJoneselsewhen
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2003 10:01 pm    Post subject: [quote]

^ ^ ^
| | |

BigManJones
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grenideer
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Joined: 28 May 2002
Posts: 149

PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2003 2:22 am    Post subject: [quote]

I wouldn't do cel shading necessarily just because it's overdone. You actually managed an original look, which is a hard thing to do. It does look a bit strange, but kinda cool. You can always experiement with different methods and see what looks best, though.
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Sirocco
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Joined: 01 Jun 2002
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2003 5:53 am    Post subject: [quote]

Honestly, I don't have a problem with the outlining, but it would look soooooooooooo much better if you went to the trouble of antialiasing the outlines. The only thing I find unpleasant is the jaggy edges contrasting with the background. Other than that, it's definitely a nifty graphic approach.

Like Ultima 7 on 'shrooms.


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resle
Slightly Deformed Faerie Princess


Joined: 23 Jun 2003
Posts: 32
Location: Roma, Italy

PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2003 8:34 am    Post subject: [quote]

Anonymous wrote:
So how did you do pathfinding? A*? How do you have the map organized? A 2d array of open/clear places?


Yes. It's a static version of A* - extremely fast. Instead of a list of open/clear places I've got the array you name, but also - I have a similar array of lists of nodes, which speeds up things a lot. It takes lots of memory but hey - is ram really a problem nowadays? ;)
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someone
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2003 9:53 pm    Post subject: not bad [quote]

not bad at all. That is som enice stuff. What model format are you using? is it md2? if so, what editor did u get?
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BigManJones
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Joined: 22 Mar 2003
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2003 11:11 pm    Post subject: [quote]

resle wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
So how did you do pathfinding? A*? How do you have the map organized? A 2d array of open/clear places?


Yes. It's a static version of A* - extremely fast. Instead of a list of open/clear places I've got the array you name, but also - I have a similar array of lists of nodes, which speeds up things a lot. It takes lots of memory but hey - is ram really a problem nowadays? ;)


Something like this?
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Mandrake
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Joined: 28 May 2002
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 12, 2003 1:32 pm    Post subject: [quote]

Quote:


Like Ultima 7 on 'shrooms.



Yes, yes it is :)

I love it. The art is fantastic and unique. It looks like a pixel game gone 3d. I love it. I worship you. No, really I do. This looks- dear gopd- fantastic. Although I do agree with Sirocco, some AA would help it. Give it a cleaner look. What are you oprogramming it in? and don't listen to those fools- they hang out with an "anti-black outline" crowd (I'm not kidding either- they do...fucking sel-out is over-hyped)...

what lang+lib you doing this in? Do I need an OpenGL compatible card?
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Sirocco
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Joined: 01 Jun 2002
Posts: 345

PostPosted: Sat Jul 12, 2003 2:21 pm    Post subject: [quote]

I'm assuming sel-out is shorthand for selective outlining. I tend to use a similar approach I call inlining. You can look at the Fenix Blade sprites and see the basic approach -- the sprite itself has no outline, but the inner components (i.e. joints, edges of clothing) get simple dividing lines. It works extremely well on small sprites.

For Frenetic Plus I went for full blown outlining with inlining as well. Because the sprites were being scaled, I couldn't use my normal shading techniques, which looked like ass when shrunk; but that's another story for another thread :)

i honestly feel both approaches have their merits, and should be used when the artist/designer feels appropriate.


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resle
Slightly Deformed Faerie Princess


Joined: 23 Jun 2003
Posts: 32
Location: Roma, Italy

PostPosted: Sat Jul 12, 2003 3:47 pm    Post subject: [quote]

someone wrote:

not bad at all. That is som enice stuff. What model format are you using? is it md2? if so, what editor did u get?


It's a proprietary model format. I can read data and port it to my format both from ASE files (3ds Max 5) and MD2 models.

BigManJones wrote:

Something like this?


Yes! But not that refined. I never coded any pathfinding algorythm before, so... well, the result is fast and easy to use - but the internal (spaghetti) code uses a lot of dirty tricks :)


Mandrake wrote:

Yes, yes it is :)

I love it. The art is fantastic and unique. It looks like a pixel game gone 3d. I love it. I worship you. No, really I do. This looks- dear gopd- fantastic. Although I do agree with Sirocco, some AA would help it. Give it a cleaner look. What are you oprogramming it in? and don't listen to those fools- they hang out with an "anti-black outline" crowd (I'm not kidding either- they do...fucking sel-out is over-hyped)...

what lang+lib you doing this in? Do I need an OpenGL compatible card?


Thanks Mandrake, if you say that "it looks like a pixel game gone 3d", my result is achieved! AntiAliasing is done, you're right - it's a lot better now. Yet is a lot slower too... looks like that line smoothing isn't hardware accelerated, or something. I will take screenshots soon.
As for language, it's Delphi+Assembler, but I am not using any external lib. And... yes: you definitely need an OpenGL compatible card! A fast one too... until I don't optimize this mess (let's say a Voodoo3 is ok but slightly slow, and a GeForce2 is perfect).
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